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> Engine Revving & Weird Idle
zippyijk
post Jan 14 2010, 10:46 PM
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Bit of a problem on the car today. (2.0TFSI octavia)
Initially when stopped the car was jumping revs approx 1k each way, could also feel a very slight rocking through the pedals and could be heard through the exhaust.
This evening it was doing the same but now it is also reving itself when I slow down, e.g. I was in 4th, lights were red up ahead so slowed and dropped into first (bit of coasting (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) ) but when I put the clutch in the car revved up to approx 23k. This is happening nearly every time I bring the car to a stop.
I also noticed when I took my foot off the accelerator the car revs slightly for a second (keeps it at the same revs), thereby still accelerating for a second or two.

Any ideas?
Not going to take it out tomorrow in case I'm doing it damage I'll take the wifes car instead.
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ChrisL
post Jan 14 2010, 11:46 PM
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Sounds like a boost leak or vac leak, check all the boost and vacume pipes for cracks... Also check the connections on all of them, make sure they're on tight

ps. Is the engine management light on? Also get vagcom on it!


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:: MK4 golf 1.8T, AUM, remap, forge 007p, pipercross panel filter w/homemade cold air feed, n249 bypass, Autobahn 88 TIP, PCV and boost hose kit, stagered BBS CH reps, AP Coilovers, genuine anni kit, 312mm front discs, + a few other bits ::
boost leaks are a c%*t

http://vimeo.com/3143797
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zippyijk
post Jan 15 2010, 07:05 AM
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QUOTE (ChrisL @ Jan 14 2010, 11:46 PM) *
Sounds like a boost leak or vac leak, check all the boost and vacume pipes for cracks... Also check the connections on all of them, make sure they're on tight

ps. Is the engine management light on? Also get vagcom on it!


No warning lights on the dash at all.
I was thinking about it this morning, would it be a dirty throttle body?
I've only had the car 5 months so I've never cleaned it myself, I remember reading about it on a uk GTI site.
Might try cleaning it first, shouldn't take too long.
I don't have a vagcom and I think I remember hearing that I'd need to do a throttle valve setup with it if I take it off?
Is it necessary?

Any other ideas welcome
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Declan
post Jan 15 2010, 08:49 AM
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Is it on a stock DV ?
Early version of the DV's in these gave bother but I'm not sure of the symptoms

Dec


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ChrisL
post Jan 15 2010, 02:04 PM
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The throttle body realligns itself over time, you only need vagcom to allign it straight away! It could be that, no harm in trying, I'd get vagcom on it anyway if you know someone who has it.. you can do vac leak tests by logging figgures somehow?? Not sure how tho


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:: MK4 golf 1.8T, AUM, remap, forge 007p, pipercross panel filter w/homemade cold air feed, n249 bypass, Autobahn 88 TIP, PCV and boost hose kit, stagered BBS CH reps, AP Coilovers, genuine anni kit, 312mm front discs, + a few other bits ::
boost leaks are a c%*t

http://vimeo.com/3143797
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zippyijk
post Jan 17 2010, 04:58 PM
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QUOTE (ChrisL @ Jan 15 2010, 02:04 PM) *
The throttle body realligns itself over time, you only need vagcom to allign it straight away! It could be that, no harm in trying, I'd get vagcom on it anyway if you know someone who has it.. you can do vac leak tests by logging figgures somehow?? Not sure how tho


Thought that alright.

I tried to remove the throttle body to clean it today but unfortunately on the 2.0T FSI it's right in the front between the engine and intercooler, pointing downwards none the less. The pipe connected to it on the bottom is too short to be able to pull it down off the throttle body so I can access the 2 back screws.
So it looks like a big job to remove it, I've seen a few 2.0T forums saying its not a garden mechanics job (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

Pretty pissed off now as it'll have to go to the garage to get checked out now. Have my NCT in less than 2 weeks so it needs to be fixed.
I'm due to get it remapped too on the 29th so hopefully it gets sorted.
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zippyijk
post Jan 28 2010, 05:55 PM
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Just an update...
The car has been in the garage for the past week, they've been working to find a cause of the errors.
Plugs & coils were replaced, needed doing anyway. Still the same.
Sent off to their other garage for further diagnostics, they came back saying there's probably carbon build up, a big problem in direct fuel injection engines like the 2.0T FSI.

Here's a couple of threads explaining (with pictures) what happens
Carbon Build Up
and
AW-Carbon buildup
and RS4's have the same problem!!
RS4 Carbon

They're going to give it the "Italian Tune-Up" tomorrow, basically rev the balls of it for 20mins straight to try clear up the deposits.
They'll also be removing the manifold to have a look inside to see how bad it is.
The car is Jan 06 so obviously out of warranty (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)
This is gonna cost me a fortune, feel as sick as a dog right now (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)
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Geo
post Jan 28 2010, 05:59 PM
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It sounds to me like neither place knows what is wrong with it and are just taking shots in the dark.

If I was in your position I wouldn't be too happy. This is your money they are spending remember. And they are spending at least some of it unecessarily, E.G. I seriously doubt the car needed 4 new coil packs so if I were you I wouldn't be paying for them anyway.


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Shane
post Jan 28 2010, 06:04 PM
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How was the car driving when you put the foot down? Hunting at idle was what my car did when it went into limp mode,another sign of limp mode is the car will be down on power and you will be getting great MPG (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Not saying your maf is the issue but how the car drove under acceleration would give you a better idea of what was wrong.


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zippyijk
post Jan 28 2010, 06:17 PM
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QUOTE (Geo @ Jan 28 2010, 05:59 PM) *
It sounds to me like neither place knows what is wrong with it and are just taking shots in the dark.

If I was in your position I wouldn't be too happy. This is your money they are spending remember. And they are spending at least some of it unecessarily, E.G. I seriously doubt the car needed 4 new coil packs so if I were you I wouldn't be paying for them anyway.


My mistake, they didn't put in 4 new coil packs, only 1, and it needed it.
In fairness they've been ringing me everyday and letting me know what they're doing, haven't put any parts on it yet without asking me.
Only new parts so far are 4 plugs (which I asked for before it even went in) and 1 coil pack.
They've been letting me know when its been worked on, been a few days where it wasn't due to bookings so I'm not worried with the costs so far, its the cost of getting it fixed if it needs a clean out.
As for taking shots in the dark, I've been looking up on the error codes myself and everything they've looked at so far I'd agree with. I'm an engineer myself and know how to troubleshoot & diagnose in a structured manner (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) so I know they're not just picking sh*t out of the air.
I had it over with Joe in urban perf and he hadn't seen anything like it before, the VCDS was giving multiple errors so it's not just them.
Cheers for the intent though, I know exactly where you're coming from (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Wonder if I'd get anywhere with Skoda Ireland seeing as this is a known issue??
Just in case it comes to it, anyone know anywhere around that could do a clean if I need it? Might be cheaper than having the garage do it?
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Geo
post Jan 28 2010, 06:19 PM
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Ok I retract my accusations about the garage (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

What were/are the fault codes?


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zippyijk
post Jan 28 2010, 06:27 PM
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QUOTE (Shane @ Jan 28 2010, 06:04 PM) *
How was the car driving when you put the foot down? Hunting at idle was what my car did when it went into limp mode,another sign of limp mode is the car will be down on power and you will be getting great MPG (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Not saying your maf is the issue but how the car drove under acceleration would give you a better idea of what was wrong.



Car was driving fine once I've my foot on the accelerator, only problems when I don't. MPG was actually worse than normal.
Wasn't in limp mode at any stage either.
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zippyijk
post Jan 28 2010, 06:38 PM
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QUOTE (Geo @ Jan 28 2010, 06:19 PM) *
Ok I retract my accusations about the garage (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

What were/are the fault codes?


Similar to these

001287 - Idle Control System RPM: Higher than Expected.
P0507 - 001 - Upper Limit Exceeded - MIL ON

008825 - Leak in Air Intake System
P2279 - 002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - MIL ON

000768 - Random/Multiple Cylinder Misfire Detected
P0300 - 002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent

000771 - Cylinder 3: Misfire Detected
P0303 - 002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent

008583 - Bank 1; System too Lean at Idle
P2187 - 004 - No Signal/Communication - MIL ON

Basically the engine is running lean which is causing the misfires.
No leaks have been found. I'd say they are right on their current theory (carbon build up).
If they are I'll get them to change the PCV valve & hose to its newest revision too, though it appears to be a problem that you can ever fully fix.
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Geo
post Jan 28 2010, 06:58 PM
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That has got to be an air leak I reckon. They can be next to impossible to find without the correct kit.

Worth replacing the cam cover breather anyway as it causes this kind of problem.

PS I don't see how carbon build up could cause your symptoms or fault codes.


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zippyijk
post Jan 28 2010, 07:25 PM
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QUOTE (Geo @ Jan 28 2010, 06:58 PM) *
That has got to be an air leak I reckon. They can be next to impossible to find without the correct kit.

Worth replacing the cam cover breather anyway as it causes this kind of problem.

PS I don't see how carbon build up could cause your symptoms or fault codes.


I thought that myself, had to be an air leak, but they're thinking is that the PCV can cause those errors and carbon build up can cause the PCV leak and from reading those threads I posted about bad carbon build up and how the PCV works, it sounds plausible.
Here's another thread from vwvortex which could explain it, though they don't think its it....I sent them the details anyway.
vwvortex PCV

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Geo
post Jan 28 2010, 07:36 PM
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QUOTE (zippyijk @ Jan 28 2010, 07:25 PM) *
and carbon build up can cause the PCV leak


It's the other way round, PCV leak causes carbon build up due to leaking oil into the intake.

Change PCV before doing anything else is my advice.


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zippyijk
post Jan 30 2010, 10:57 AM
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QUOTE (Geo @ Jan 28 2010, 07:36 PM) *
It's the other way round, PCV leak causes carbon build up due to leaking oil into the intake.

Change PCV before doing anything else is my advice.


I've taken the car back as they haven't fixed it.
Going to go and replace the PCV myself, worth a try.

Here are the error codes its havin...
04759 P1297 Connection charger-throttle valve Pressure Drop
08825 P2279 Intake Air System Leak
01287 P0507 Idle Control System RPM Higher than Expected
00768 P0300 Random/Multiple Cylinder Misfire Detected
(Then usually one of the 4 cylinders giving a misfire detected error)
04688 P1250 Fuel level too low
04243 P1093 Bank1, fuel measuring system 2 Malfunction

Nice list there! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

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Geo
post Jan 30 2010, 05:57 PM
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I'd put money on this being a PCV valve fault.


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Shane
post Feb 3 2010, 10:22 PM
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Zippy i moved your DIY post to a thread of its own and made it a sticky,well done we need more threads like this on here!

Your DIY thread is here


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